The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast
375. Sacrificing the Poor to NOT Save the Planet | Robert Bryce
Thu Jul 13 2023Description
This episode covers a wide range of topics related to energy, environment, and climate change. It discusses the funding of a solar project in Angola despite the lack of electricity access for the majority of the population. The negative impact of Germany's energy policies and the importance of affordable energy for the poor are also highlighted. The episode emphasizes the crucial role of electricity provision for women and girls, as well as the need for reliable energy sources in the face of extreme weather trends. It explores the shift towards nuclear power as a solution for reducing emissions and the challenges and drawbacks of wind and solar energy. The limitations and challenges of renewable energy sources, supply chain vulnerabilities, and the importance of long-term thinking are discussed. The episode concludes with insights on the importance of affordable and reliable energy for all.
Insights
Funding solar projects in developing countries without addressing electricity access is problematic
The US Export Import Bank funded a solar project in Angola despite 60% of the people in Angola not having electricity. Imposing climate concerns on the developing world without prioritizing electricity provision sacrifices the poor to serve planetary concerns.
Germany's energy policies have led to increased pollution and higher energy prices
Germany's decision to shut down nuclear plants and rely on lignite coal has resulted in increased pollution per kilowatt and higher prices for liquefied natural gas (LNG). Their expansion of lignite mines contradicts their goal of reducing CO2 emissions.
Electricity availability is crucial for women's liberation from household chores
Access to electricity, especially for women and girls, is crucial for liberation from household chores. 2.5 billion women and girls wash clothes by hand, limiting their opportunities. Unlocking their brain power through electricity access could have significant economic value.
Reliable energy sources are necessary in the face of extreme weather trends
Focusing excessively on climate change neglects other important issues. If extreme weather increases, we will need more reliable energy sources. Dependence on weather-dependent renewables for energy makes no sense in the face of extreme weather trends.
Nuclear power is a viable option for reducing emissions and bringing people out of darkness
Fossil fuels are not running out, and new technology can double the known store of fossil fuels in the U.S. Natural gas and nuclear power should be the way forward for reducing emissions and bringing more people out of darkness. Encouraging moves towards nuclear power have been seen in various countries.
The limitations and drawbacks of wind and solar energy
Wind power has numerous environmental issues, including unreliability, short lifespan, high decommissioning costs, and harm to wildlife. Solar panels and wind generators are not truly renewable due to limited lifespans and the need for replacement. The variability of wind conditions and the placement of wind turbines in saltwater pose engineering challenges.
Supply chain vulnerabilities and the importance of long-term thinking
There is a lack of long-term thinking and strategic planning in addressing supply chain vulnerabilities. The reliance on Chinese supply chains for alternative energy commodities raises concerns about strategic vulnerabilities and long-term thinking in the US. The focus on CO2 as the only concern in alternative energy pushes neglects reliability, affordability, and resilience.
Affordable and reliable energy is crucial for all
Affordability means poor people don't die, and reliability means your food doesn't rot in your refrigerator. Increasing energy costs hit the poorest people the hardest. Unreliable electricity leads to backup generators and higher costs. Bringing electricity to more people, especially women and girls, is crucial. Being pro-poor and anti-energy are incompatible.
Summary of the episode's key insights
Robert has intelligent things to say on the energy and environment front. It's important to eschew cheap moralizing and focus on supplying energy to poor people. Looking forward to Robert's documentary and report for the Alliance for Responsible Citizenship. Next, Jordan will talk to Robert about his motivations for dedicating his life to the energy environment nexus.
Chapters
- The US Export Import Bank funded a solar project in Angola
- Germany's energy and environment policies have been catastrophic
- The importance of electricity provision and its impact on women and girls
- The need for reliable energy sources in the face of extreme weather trends
- The shift towards nuclear power as a solution for reducing emissions
- The shift towards nuclear power in various countries
- The prioritization of energy security and growth in developing countries
- The negative impact of green movements and the importance of affordable energy
- The developmental pathway to cleaner and more reliable energy
- The limitations of renewable energy sources and the focus on climate change
- The challenges and drawbacks of wind energy
- The impact of wind energy on landscapes and supply chain vulnerabilities
- The limitations and challenges of solar energy
- The importance of long-term thinking and addressing supply chain vulnerabilities
- The importance of affordable and reliable energy for all
- Summary of the episode's key insights
The US Export Import Bank funded a solar project in Angola
00:03 - 07:32
- Despite 60% of the people in Angola not having electricity
- Imposing climate concerns on the developing world is a colonialist endeavor and sacrifices the poor to serve planetary concerns
- Multilateral lending institutions refuse to fund hydrocarbon projects in developing countries, hindering their access to electricity
- Building a solar power plant as the number one concern for Angola's international development is absurd when they have abundant natural gas and oil resources
- Restricting developing countries from burning hydrocarbons is green colonialism and carbon imperialism
- Providing electricity is crucial for improving lives globally, but preventing developing countries from using hydrocarbons hinders progress
Germany's energy and environment policies have been catastrophic
07:13 - 14:27
- Germany is polluting more per kilowatt than 15 years ago due to shutting down reasonable sources of electricity and turning to burning lignite coal
- Germany's expansion of lignite mines contradicts their goal of reducing CO2 emissions
- Germany's decision to shut down nuclear plants has led to increased reliance on lignite coal and higher prices for liquefied natural gas (LNG)
- The German government's policies have made the export of Canadian fossil fuel resources impossible, hindering potential LNG imports from Canada
- California has emulated Germany's renewable energy mandates and experienced no reduction in overall emissions or electric prices since 2008
- California's aggressive climate policies disproportionately affect the poor and middle class, leading to high electric rates and a high poverty rate
- Left-leaning politicians supporting pharmaceutical companies during the pandemic is similar to their support for ruinously regressive climate policies that harm the poor
- Lowering energy costs would be the best way to improve the lives of poor people
The importance of electricity provision and its impact on women and girls
13:57 - 20:31
- Left's support for pharmaceutical companies is staggering
- Lowering energy costs and prioritizing energy provision improves the lives of the poor
- Increase in population does not lead to resource scarcity or starvation
- When people reach $5,000 GDP per year, they become concerned about local environmental issues
- Electricity availability, especially for women and girls, is crucial for liberation from household chores
- 2.5 billion women and girls wash clothes by hand, limiting their opportunities
- Unlocking the brain power of these individuals could have significant economic value
The need for reliable energy sources in the face of extreme weather trends
20:11 - 27:04
- Focusing excessively on climate change neglects other important issues
- If extreme weather increases, we will need more reliable energy sources
- Dependence on weather-dependent renewables for energy makes no sense in the face of extreme weather trends
- Claims of running out of fossil fuels have been proven false with new technologies
The shift towards nuclear power as a solution for reducing emissions
26:34 - 33:17
- Fossil fuels are not running out and new technology can double the known store of fossil fuels in the U.S.
- The narrative on climate change has shifted from global cooling to global warming and now to climate change
- There is no evidence that hurricanes are increasing in frequency, and increased costs are due to building expensive properties in hurricane-prone areas
- The world has greened by 15% since 2000, with plants thriving in semi-arid areas due to increased carbon dioxide levels
- Natural gas and nuclear power should be the way forward for reducing emissions and bringing more people out of darkness
- Climate activist groups spending billions of dollars a year are often anti-nuclear, which doesn't make sense if we're serious about reducing CO2 emissions
- Encouraging moves towards nuclear power have been seen in countries like Romania, France, Finland, Sweden, and the US
The shift towards nuclear power in various countries
33:00 - 39:55
- Countries like Romania, Finland, Sweden, and France are shifting towards nuclear power in the wake of the Russia-Ukraine war
- Canada has significant reserves of uranium and is revitalizing its nuclear sector
- China, Russia, Britain, Poland, and Romania are also building or pushing their nuclear technology
- The recognition that nuclear power is necessary for reducing emissions is a positive outcome of the conflict
- Small modular reactors (SMRs) and molten salt technologies show promise for the future of nuclear power
- X-energy's high-temperature gas reactor is considered safer than water-based reactors and has attracted interest from Dow Chemical Company
- Industrial consumers see the value in using high temperature heat from nuclear reactors for their processes
- Standardized production of one or two designs can help accelerate the deployment of nuclear power plants
- Regulatory regimes and fuel availability are friction points that need to be addressed for a nuclear renaissance
The prioritization of energy security and growth in developing countries
39:25 - 46:26
- The Japanese are prioritizing energy security over concerns about climate change
- Japan is building coal-fired power plants and reopening nuclear reactors to meet their energy needs
- China is also expanding both nuclear and coal-fired power capacity
- Emissions from the West are becoming less significant as countries like Vietnam, Bangladesh, Pakistan, India, and China experience rapid growth in energy consumption
- Vietnam is expanding its coal mining capacity to address its power shortage
- The iron law of electricity states that people, countries, and businesses will prioritize getting the electricity they need over climate change concerns
- Increasing energy costs can push people back into poverty and lead to environmentally harmful practices like slash-and-burn agriculture and burning low-energy dense fuels indoors
The negative impact of green movements and the importance of affordable energy
45:59 - 52:54
- Raising energy prices devastates the poor and worsens the planet
- The green movement is anti-industrial and anti-human
- Green activists are not supportive of nuclear energy despite its zero carbon dioxide output
- Western NGOs and the World Bank refuse to lend money to developing countries to raise them out of poverty
- There are overlaps between Christian beliefs and climate catastrophe ideas
- Indoor air pollution caused by low-density fuels kills millions of women and girls in developing countries
- Expensive energy is the enemy of the poor
- Policies aimed at making energy more expensive are fundamentally wrong
- Europe's delusions of repentance sacrifice hundreds of millions of people on the altar of Gaia
- There is a developmental pathway to cleaner and more reliable energy
The developmental pathway to cleaner and more reliable energy
52:32 - 59:23
- Developmental pathway to cleaner and more reliable energy starts with dung, wheat straw, wood, and then progresses to coal, oil or natural gas, and nuclear
- Developed countries are gradually decarbonizing while underdeveloped countries are still at the biomass stage
- Africa's rapid urbanization requires a massive amount of electricity compared to developed countries like Canada
- Natural gas and nuclear energy are lower carbon options that can scale at relatively low cost
- Helping developing countries develop their natural gas and nuclear energy infrastructure is crucial for decarbonization and electrification
- Ultra-supercritical technology can make coal-fired plants cleaner but it is more expensive
- Coal is geographically widespread, cheap, and abundant, making it a growth industry in many countries
The limitations of renewable energy sources and the focus on climate change
58:57 - 1:05:52
- The development of coal-fired plants will be detrimental to the international market
- Global warming and climate change require a global approach
- Making cleaner electricity cheaper is the way forward
- Net zero carbon output is impossible and not necessary; reducing by 80% would be sufficient
- European politicians are starting to realize the limitations of net zero goals
- Wind power has numerous environmental issues, including unreliability, short lifespan, high decommissioning costs, and harm to wildlife
- Power density is crucial in understanding energy systems; nuclear power has high power density compared to wind and solar
- Wind energy requires vast amounts of land, impacting more people
The challenges and drawbacks of wind energy
1:05:24 - 1:12:33
- To generate all the electricity in the US with wind energy, a land area of 900,000 square kilometers is needed
- Wind projects can negatively impact rural communities by hurting property values and producing noise pollution
- The wind industry is driven by tax credits and subsidies
- Mid-American Energy sued Madison County, Iowa after they passed an ordinance banning new wind projects
- The wind industry is responsible for killing a significant number of birds, but there is no accountability or reporting requirement
- NextEra Energy was prosecuted for building a wind project in known golden eagle habitat in Wyoming
- Climateism has replaced care for the environment, leading to the proliferation of wind turbines and solar panels without considering their impact on the landscape
- Overfishing in coastal oceans is a major environmental problem that receives less attention due to the focus on carbon dioxide emissions
The impact of wind energy on landscapes and supply chain vulnerabilities
1:12:07 - 1:18:44
- Devastating impact on ocean life with 95% eradication on coastal shelves
- Attention focused on carbon dioxide while ignoring other serious environmental problems
- Industrial development claiming carbon dioxide remediation gets a pass
- NGOs not protesting offshore wind development in North Atlantic right whale habitat
- Environmentalism has been forsaken for climatism and renewable energy fetishism
- Reputation matters, false avenues to reputation offered by psychopaths, narcissists, and ideologues
- Sacrificing real problems for pseudo-problems solutions
- Protesting through vandalism is a pathetic opposition signal
- Lack of awareness of privilege and global electricity poverty among young activists
The limitations and challenges of solar energy
1:18:27 - 1:25:19
- Solar panels and wind generators are not truly renewable because they have limited lifespans and need to be replaced
- Siemens Manufacturing Company experienced problems with their windmill generating systems, potentially due to the forces on the machines tearing them apart
- The variability of wind conditions and the placement of wind turbines in saltwater pose engineering challenges
- The supply chains for alternative energy, such as electric vehicles, heavily rely on China for key commodities like neodymium iron boron magnets, terbium, dysprosium, graphite, and copper
- China controls a significant portion of the global market for these commodities, raising concerns about strategic vulnerabilities and long-term thinking in the US
The importance of long-term thinking and addressing supply chain vulnerabilities
1:24:52 - 1:32:16
- Lack of long-term thinking and strategic planning in addressing supply chain vulnerabilities
- Repatriating industries may not be feasible due to regulatory environment and environmental costs
- Solar industry's reliance on Chinese supply chains and potential connection to Uighur slave labor
- Alt-energy discussion overlooks the interrelatedness of networks and vulnerability to foreign suppliers
- Reliability problems in the US electric grid due to fast shuttering of coal plants
- Narrow focus on CO2 as the only concern in alt-energy push, neglecting reliability, affordability, and resilience
- Blackouts in Texas highlight the need for deeper understanding of energy issues
- Upcoming docuseries on power, politics, and the grid
The importance of affordable and reliable energy for all
1:31:46 - 1:38:25
- Affordability means poor people don't die
- Reliability means your food doesn't rot in your refrigerator
- Increasing energy costs hit the poorest people the hardest
- Unreliable electricity leads to backup generators and higher costs
- Electricity is fundamental and makes us more human
- Bringing electricity to more people, especially women and girls, is crucial
- Being pro-poor and anti-energy are incompatible
- The goal is to drive energy prices down and explore different fuel sources
- Continual abundance and reliability or a broken world with worse environmental impact are the options
Summary of the episode's key insights
1:38:10 - 1:39:40
- Robert has intelligent things to say on the energy and environment front
- It's important to eschew cheap moralizing and focus on supplying energy to poor people
- Looking forward to Robert's documentary and report for the Alliance for Responsible Citizenship
- Next, Jordan will talk to Robert about his motivations for dedicating his life to the energy environment nexus